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THANK YOU SOOOOOOO MUCH - SAVED ANOTHER POTENTIAL VICTIM
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dexter
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:27 am    

THANK YOU SOOOOOOO MUCH - SAVED ANOTHER POTENTIAL VICTIM
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My father who we had bought a K for about 5 or 6 years ago, his K is amazingly still in one piece and crack free for now, had sent me info from a news letter about them looking to establish dealers and since have been trading e-mails with RJ working to become a dealer. It looked to be a great opportunity being that there was no up front franchise or dealer fee, just order at wholsale prices and I'm a dealer. My wife and I had been doing product research on Kamado and that is when we came across your " Kamado Fraud Forum " I did'nt want to believe at first, but there are other site postings out there claiming many of the same things. My business partner and I were maybe a week or two from ordering 15k or so of product from him and in a hurry for the local home show in Febuary which I doubt he could have delivered.

After reading many postings on your site and trading e-mails it funny to see his explanations to my questions on why the factory has moved so many times, he said to much red tape and quality of local labor. I also asked why he did not have a dealer locater tab on his site, how many dealers did he have and could I speak with them. He completely ignored those questions which raised a red flag for me and then I found your site.

I have quite a e-mail string from him if anyone is interested.


AGAIN, THANKS SO MUCH FOR SAVING US
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fishtail-99



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 1437

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:09 am    

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An annotated listing of the emails would certainly be interesting. As long as the emails don't say "Confidential - to be read by reciptient only" or something like that, it is merely bad breeding to post them. And bad breeding isn't a problem around here. But seriously, if you were to document your experience along with what RJ said, and why what the red flags were, it might save a few more souls.....
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curly



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 665

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 10:49 am    

Re: THANK YOU SOOOOOOO MUCH - SAVED ANOTHER POTENTIAL VICTIM
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dexter wrote:


I have quite a e-mail string from him if anyone is interested.


AGAIN, THANKS SO MUCH FOR SAVING US


Yes, the emails may save another. Each one reach one!
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foxhound
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 11:17 am    

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dexter....Kamado OC seems to be either one of his victims or a partner in crime. They announced him in Dec. 2006 on their website. His first problem was trying to sell the charcoal at twice the price RJ was selling for. I'm not sure, but it sounds as though he paid as much for his product to resell as the rest of the customers. Last I heard, he had a bunch of units he was trying to unload for $400 less than RJ without warranty. Seems he already discovered there were warranty problems as a couple of units he had had problems and RJ would not return his calls or emails.

Did he tell you of his website? Did you not see the continued history of people having problems with customer service? Even his supporters acknowledge he doesn't answer phone calls or return email. You gotta be suspicious of a business that ignores their phone calls the way kamado does. The phone is the lifeline of a business, and they are a word of mouth advertiser. They have no respect for their customers. To them a customer is an opportunity to deceive. The concept of earning business is very foreign to them.

I am curious what area you are from, as I understand he is now pushing to capture Home show vendors. It would seem he is not being careful of how many vendors he sells to in a given territory. I would imagine that there may be multiple vendors showing up at the same home shows and competing with each other, but that won't matter to him because he will have been paid for the product.

What discount was he offering you to buy his BBQ's. Did he tell you what he was selling for? I would like to hear the whole scam that he proposed. It would always help if there is something that could be pursued criminally.
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dexter
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 11:19 am    

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I will post the entire e-mail string once I'm done with him. It should be done by Monday if he will not answer my request to speak with some of his dealers, which I suspect he will not, In which case I will let him know the " kamado fraud forum " saved another victim.
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dexter
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 11:28 am    

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sam: I experienced some of their stellar customer service when buying my dad his k 5 or 6 years ago. I was supposed to have it for Christmas which was a couple of months away but it ended up taking about 6 or 7 months to get, we did get the k in good condition and it has had no problems to this point. From what I have read I was lucky. I do have more info and will post when I'm done trading e-mails with him.
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Knotter



Joined: 07 Sep 2007
Posts: 64

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 11:31 am    

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Thanks for posting Dexter. Glad we saved another.

I too seen Kamado's plea for investors. And, I too almost bit on the deal. I believe in investing in products I own and use and am happy with.

Just so happened at the time, I was having a run around with Kamado over another product I purchased. At that point I realized the company values for satisfying customers were totally different than mine, and as such was not the type company I wanted to be invested with.

Since then my Kamado has all but fallen apart. Efforts to resolve anything have been enormous, to say the least. Not a company I'd beat their door down to buy from again, that's for sure.
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fishtail-99



Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 1437

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:22 pm    

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Dexter, of course, once you find out he stiffed The BBQ Guru for $10,000 worth of BBQ Guru merchandise (and this particular fact is instantly verifiable by calling the BBQ Guru and talking to the owner), all the other stories about RJ and fraud become plausible. You can also talk to a Mr. Tony Oliver who was stiffed for a distributorship. He paid tens of thousands for the distributorship and then RJ wouldn't ship him any product or return his money. This is why we KNOW RJ is a crook and not just the victim of a few pissed off owners. Why oh why can't someone with a lot of money set up a sting and invite RJ to visit them and have the process servers waiting for him, lol!
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foxhound
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 1:42 pm    

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dexter wrote:
I will post the entire e-mail string once I'm done with him. It should be done by Monday if he will not answer my request to speak with some of his dealers, which I suspect he will not, In which case I will let him know the " kamado fraud forum " saved another victim.


I can't believe at this point you would want to bother with the 'other dealers'. After what you know at this point why would you want any continued involvement with him? The past is littered with people who have tried to associate themselves with RJ and lost their investments. He has mastered being too slick to litigate him. What do you think will be accomplished by continuing any further discussions?
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dexter
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 2:00 pm    

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I just want to see how much crap he is willing to spew out. I'm not going to contact any dealers after what I have seen here, not sure there are any at this point. I'm just gather more crap to post about him at this point.
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foxhound
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 2:45 pm    

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It hasn't been that long ago he started soliciting dealers, if he has any there is a good chance they have not even received product yet. From my understanding Kamado OC is not a happy camper. I can get his phone number...but he will try to sell you his stock. Very Happy Very Happy

You did not say where you are from?
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The Spanker



Joined: 10 Nov 2006
Posts: 207

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 2:53 pm    

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sam wrote:
....Kamado OC seems to be either one of his victims or a partner in crime. They announced him in Dec. 2006 on their website. His first problem was trying to sell the charcoal at twice the price RJ was selling for. I'm not sure, but it sounds as though he paid as much for his product to resell as the rest of the customers. Last I heard, he had a bunch of units he was trying to unload for $400 less than RJ without warranty. Seems he already discovered there were warranty problems as a couple of units he had had problems and RJ would not return his calls or emails.



I don't think there's any doubt Kamado OC is a victim. The poor SOB never dreamed he would have to compete with factory direct sales of charcoal and cookers from the manufacturer. He tried to make an appropriate profit on a luxury, small volume item, probably at a mark up similar to what most BGE dealers once sold their BGE charcoal for, and got ridiculed on the manufacturer's website for doing so.

It's an absurd business structure. A manufacturer can either have factory direct or can have a network of distributors and dealers but not both. Especially now, when many potential buyers research their purchases via the internet. If the Chevy dealer sells me on the notion of buying a pickup truck for 30k but then I find out I can buy it from Chevy direct for 15k, that dealer has been terribly terribly screwed out of their time and investment. Likewise a K dealer in the same situation.

And pity the poor dealer that sells an order for a cooker at a home show only to have the buyer find out that the same cooker can be had for far cheaper from the K company during one of their recurring specials.

It's an experience that former K dealers all share. It's shameful.
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foxhound
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 3:24 pm    

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Spanker....check your private message
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tcoliver



Joined: 09 Jul 2006
Posts: 240

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 3:48 pm    

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Its the same scam I fell for. Dexter feel free to PM me and I will give you my phone number. I can tell you the horrible experiences I have had, unfortunately I did not have this forum to save me so as stated I lost over $40,000 from that scumbag. I wish there was a way to put him behind bars where he belongs, unfortunately I don't have the resources to waste to do so. Glad to hear you were a lucky one.
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dexter
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2007 6:08 pm    

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RJ did reply to my last e-mail requesting dealer info and contacts, looks like he might have another victim in Durango, CO. and I got contact info. A home design center is opening in there in the next month and he says they are a new dealer. He mentioned they ordered 4 Kamados and 40lbs of charcoal. I will call this guy tonight to warn him. I can also validate myself, as I have two freinds that have lived in Durango for 15 years plus that build custom houses and are well known for their quality of work on very expensive homes. I will find out if this is this guy is part of the sam or not soon. My friends will eaither have heard of the design center or will get to know them very soon, Durango is not a big town and word travels fast.

I'm a Colorado resident
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